More questions for Maher ;-)

[humbert]

 Maher, could you please satisfy my curiosity on the following topics:

(I) If for whatever reason you needed to travel to a city in Israel, could you? What I see on the news (and I believe the news media maybe 5% or less), is that Palestinians have to endure checkpoints and hours of waiting plus innumerable questions in order to cross over. Is this true or what?

(2) Also, as a Jordanian citizen, in order to obtain your passport did you have to prove that you fulfilled some sort of military obligation? I'm asking because in this hemisphere, this is the law in places like Colombia and even my wife's country (Mexico). In these countries those who are financially well-to-do always manage to bribe themselves out of serving in the army and still secure the proper paperwork proving their obligation has been met. Does a similar law exist in Jordan, and can you get out of it the same way?

[Maher]

Maher, could you please satisfy my curiosity on the following topics:

(I) If for whatever reason you needed to travel to a city in Israel, could you? What I see on the news (and I believe the news media maybe 5% or less), is that Palestinians have to endure checkpoints and hours of waiting plus innumerable questions in order to cross over. Is this true or what?

(2) Also, as a Jordanian citizen, in order to obtain your passport did you have to prove that you fulfilled some sort of military obligation? I'm asking because in this hemisphere, this is the law in places like Colombia and even my wife's country (Mexico). In these countries those who are financially well-to-do always manage to bribe themselves out of serving in the army and still secure the proper paperwork proving their obligation has been met. Does a similar law exist in Jordan, and can you get out of it the same way?

If a Palestinian want to go to a city in Israel he has to get something like a Visa! Without this Visa you can't enter Israel.
If you have the Visa you need to wait on those checkpoints you were talking about.

Since I was born in Jordan, and my father is Jordanian, you don't need to proof anything I think in USA, anyone born in there can get a US citizenship.

[humbert]

If a Palestinian want to go to a city in Israel he has to get something like a Visa! Without this Visa you can't enter Israel.
If you have the Visa you need to wait on those checkpoints you were talking about.
Since I was born in Jordan, and my father is Jordanian, you don't need to proof anything I think in USA, anyone born in there can get a US citizenship.

Not that you would want to go to Israel, but life is stranger than we can imagine. An example of what I mean... if exactly 6 months ago someone in Miami would have told me I'd be sending this message today from a big house in San Antonio, I would have never believed it. Similarly, an occasion may arise where you need to go to Israel. As a Jordanian citizen, could you travel to the Israeli embassy in Amman (assuming that still exists, I remember under King Hussein they signed a peace treaty) and obtain a visa? I would imagine the treatment for Jordanians must be different than for Palestinians.

In the US, anyone born here is automatically a citizen, regardless of parentage. Let me explain. This law was enacted into the constitution in 1865 when the Civil War ended precisely to make the former Black slaves citizens. It was critical that parentage not be included because the parents of the former slaves were not citizens, they were nothing more than property not very different from livestock. Since this is not a law but a constitutional amendment, changing it is not easy, plus the fact that many people here oppose any change or just don't care. You can also become a naturalized citizen (as I am). All they require is 5 years of continuous residence, no criminal record, and basic knowledge of English and American history and government. Spouses of Americans require just 3 years. I found the test easy and passed it on the first try many years ago. I hold a US passport and even a Cuban passport, which is useless unless you use to travel to Cuba -- with it I can come and go any time.

One more thing -- despite what you told me about your birthplace, your citizenship and your father's, do you personally consider yourself Palestinian or Jordanian, or both?

[Maher]

If a Palestinian want to go to a city in Israel he has to get something like a Visa! Without this Visa you can't enter Israel.
If you have the Visa you need to wait on those checkpoints you were talking about.
Since I was born in Jordan, and my father is Jordanian, you don't need to proof anything I think in USA, anyone born in there can get a US citizenship.

Not that you would want to go to Israel, but life is stranger than we can imagine. An example of what I mean... if exactly 6 months ago someone in Miami would have told me I'd be sending this message today from a big house in San Antonio, I would have never believed it. Similarly, an occasion may arise where you need to go to Israel. As a Jordanian citizen, could you travel to the Israeli embassy in Amman (assuming that still exists, I remember under King Hussein they signed a peace treaty) and obtain a visa? I would imagine the treatment for Jordanians must be different than for Palestinians.

In the US, anyone born here is automatically a citizen, regardless of parentage. Let me explain. This law was enacted into the constitution in 1865 when the Civil War ended precisely to make the former Black slaves citizens. It was critical that parentage not be included because the parents of the former slaves were not citizens, they were nothing more than property not very different from livestock. Since this is not a law but a constitutional amendment, changing it is not easy, plus the fact that many people here oppose any change or just don't care. You can also become a naturalized citizen (as I am). All they require is 5 years of continuous residence, no criminal record, and basic knowledge of English and American history and government. Spouses of Americans require just 3 years. I found the test easy and passed it on the first try many years ago. I hold a US passport and even a Cuban passport, which is useless unless you use to travel to Cuba -- with it I can come and go any time.

One more thing -- despite what you told me about your birthplace, your citizenship and your father's, do you personally consider yourself Palestinian or Jordanian, or both?

You need to know something, most Jordanians are originally Palestinians! That happened when most Palestinians left their homes in 1948 when the war began.
So in Jordan, you can go to the Israeli embassy in Amman and apply for a Visa. But more than 50% are rejected, and the main reason is that they are originally Palestinians.
If you are pure Jordanian you have a better chance of getting a Visa to Israel, but still not 100% chance you will get! It's about 60%.

Regarding your latest question, I consider myself both Palestinian and Jordanian

[humbert]

You need to know something, most Jordanians are originally Palestinians! That happened when most Palestinians left their homes in 1948 when the war began.
So in Jordan, you can go to the Israeli embassy in Amman and apply for a Visa. But more than 50% are rejected, and the main reason is that they are originally Palestinians.
If you are pure Jordanian you have a better chance of getting a Visa to Israel, but still not 100% chance you will get! It's about 60%.

Correct, I'm familiar with the fact that most Jordanians are originally Palestinian. However, if you have a Jordanian address which I'm sure you do because your dad is Jordanian, how do they know you're Palestinian? Neither Palestinians nor Jordanians carry signs or wear T-shirts to identify themselves as such. Even if you had some document issued by the occupiers to identify yourself, you wouldn't show it at the embassy.

Also, and again not that you want to go to Israel but life is strange, hasn't it occurred to you that in all probability you'd be among the 60% that got a visa? Consider this: as far as I know you are clean with the occupiers, you don't mess with them and vice versa. You go to work every day and have an honest job teaching computer science. I see no reason why they'd deny you a visa, assuming the day arrived when a very important reason came up for you to travel there. My favorite reason (and this is NOT impossible) is that you met an Israeli girl soldier on patrol and both of you fell madly in love  .  Unthinkable? Maybe so. I wish I had a dollar for the number of times the unthinkable happens.

[Maher]

You need to know something, most Jordanians are originally Palestinians! That happened when most Palestinians left their homes in 1948 when the war began.
So in Jordan, you can go to the Israeli embassy in Amman and apply for a Visa. But more than 50% are rejected, and the main reason is that they are originally Palestinians.
If you are pure Jordanian you have a better chance of getting a Visa to Israel, but still not 100% chance you will get! It's about 60%.

Correct, I'm familiar with the fact that most Jordanians are originally Palestinian. However, if you have a Jordanian address which I'm sure you do because your dad is Jordanian, how do they know you're Palestinian? Neither Palestinians nor Jordanians carry signs or wear T-shirts to identify themselves as such. Even if you had some document issued by the occupiers to identify yourself, you wouldn't show it at the embassy.

Also, and again not that you want to go to Israel but life is strange, hasn't it occurred to you that in all probability you'd be among the 60% that got a visa? Consider this: as far as I know you are clean with the occupiers, you don't mess with them and vice versa. You go to work every day and have an honest job teaching computer science. I see no reason why they'd deny you a visa, assuming the day arrived when a very important reason came up for you to travel there. My favorite reason (and this is NOT impossible) is that you met an Israeli girl soldier on patrol and both of you fell madly in love  .  Unthinkable? Maybe so. I wish I had a dollar for the number of times the unthinkable happens.

They know, trust me! They have their ways of doing it, but they certainly know.

I said 60% for pure Jordanians
Anyhow, in the summer I applied for a Visa to visit Jerusalem and I got it. We were 12, and only 2 of us got the visa, see?

[humbert]

They know, trust me! They have their ways of doing it, but they certainly know.
I said 60% for pure Jordanians
Anyhow, in the summer I applied for a Visa to visit Jerusalem and I got it. We were 12, and only 2 of us got the visa, see?

SEE? What did I tell you? I said you'd be among the 1% of Palestinians that they'd issue visas to, and you just confirmed I was right    You don't have to swear on the Qu'ran when you tell me they know who's who. I've dealt with them here (in Miami, actually -- I have yet to see one in SA), and I know for a fact they are very astute and they live by the phrase "information is power". In your specific case, they know you're not a troublemaker, that you teach computer science, and you visit the mosque to pray in peace. Sure, you (and I) despise them, but then again, doesn't every Palestinian? Why do you think I keep saying one of these days a sexy Israeli girl soldier is going to chase you down? You are definitely boyfriend material for her    Sure, we laugh at all this, but one of these days you'll remember me. 

I clearly remember one time when I started asking you stuff, you said [not your exact words] "despite all, I'm OK here".  You are clearly very smart -- you know not to argue when the other guy has a rifle and you don't. You're familiar with Machiavelli's quote "deal with life as it truly is, not as you'd like it to be". Any enemy has more difficulty dealing with a smart guy than with a troublemaker.

[Maher]

They know, trust me! They have their ways of doing it, but they certainly know.
I said 60% for pure Jordanians
Anyhow, in the summer I applied for a Visa to visit Jerusalem and I got it. We were 12, and only 2 of us got the visa, see?

SEE? What did I tell you? I said you'd be among the 1% of Palestinians that they'd issue visas to, and you just confirmed I was right    You don't have to swear on the Qu'ran when you tell me they know who's who. I've dealt with them here (in Miami, actually -- I have yet to see one in SA), and I know for a fact they are very astute and they live by the phrase "information is power". In your specific case, they know you're not a troublemaker, that you teach computer science, and you visit the mosque to pray in peace. Sure, you (and I) despise them, but then again, doesn't every Palestinian? Why do you think I keep saying one of these days a sexy Israeli girl soldier is going to chase you down? You are definitely boyfriend material for her    Sure, we laugh at all this, but one of these days you'll remember me. 

I clearly remember one time when I started asking you stuff, you said [not your exact words] "despite all, I'm OK here".  You are clearly very smart -- you know not to argue when the other guy has a rifle and you don't. You're familiar with Machiavelli's quote "deal with life as it truly is, not as you'd like it to be". Any enemy has more difficulty dealing with a smart guy than with a troublemaker.

I just say that I'm more than happy to have you here at my forums Humb, and to have you as a friend as well.

[humbert]

I just say that I'm more than happy to have you here at my forums Humb, and to have you as a friend as well.

Believe me, the feeling is mutual!! What I have learned from you can't be found in any book, and this is not to even begin to mention our personal friendship.

Incidentally (ooohh... another question) 
You told me once you didn't carry a prayer rug, but rather you pray at the mosque since there are quite a few in Qalquilya. How do you manage this given the fact you have a job? When prayer time arrives, do you just leave your students sitting in class and run off -- or is it like Saudi Arabia where everything shuts down 5 times a day? If I were a Muslim here and tried that, I'd be fired -- NOT because of my religion (that's illegal), but for leaving the job without it being an authorized break time.

[Maher]

I just say that I'm more than happy to have you here at my forums Humb, and to have you as a friend as well.

Believe me, the feeling is mutual!! What I have learned from you can't be found in any book, and this is not to even begin to mention our personal friendship.

Incidentally (ooohh... another question) 
You told me once you didn't carry a prayer rug, but rather you pray at the mosque since there are quite a few in Qalquilya. How do you manage this given the fact you have a job? When prayer time arrives, do you just leave your students sitting in class and run off -- or is it like Saudi Arabia where everything shuts down 5 times a day? If I were a Muslim here and tried that, I'd be fired -- NOT because of my religion (that's illegal), but for leaving the job without it being an authorized break time.

One prayer happens to be in the time of my job. At school we have breaks, I can do my prayer at the break.
Because we are all Muslims here, in any job you can have a 10 mins break or so to do prayers