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Started by aa1234779, December 20, 2018, 02:40 AM
Quote from: scarface on December 23, 2018, 11:17 PMWell, I have the impression that you don't criticize Islam, but the Saudi and Egyptian governments.
QuoteIf you were here, you'd probably be a yellow jacket to stand against the government's policy (but you need to practice eating sausages and drinking whiskey). In some countries, those who are criticizing Islam are even more threatened
QuoteFinally countries like Saudi Arabia, Iraq or Turkey are caught between two stools: when they have terrorists who want a strict application of Sharia and the eviction of the "false Muslims" (those who are not Sunnis), they don't know what to do. And if they are applying strict rules (obligation to wear a beard and a towel on the head for every man, obligation for every man to work in fields or in carpentry workshops while women are allowed to stay at home), they are facing hordes of angry intellectuals clamoring for more liberty and rights.
QuoteHere is another video with Oukacha (French with English subtitles), who was threatened because of his stance regarding Islam (lately he said: "I do not like Islam and as long as I have the right to freely criticize this religion I will do it. I understand that it upsets you because it is your religion. An irrational, violent and freedom-destroying religion that you take literally").https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zZ1DEHHDg6k
Quote from: scarface on December 24, 2018, 11:12 AMIf humbert or Maher are reading this, well, I'd like registrations on the forum to be opened again so that we can invite some users. I'm thinking about Majid Oukacha, who could answer aa1234779 for example (I hope you watched the video in the previous message). I'm also thinking about Kim Dotcom.
Quote from: aa1234779 on December 24, 2018, 11:39 AMMajid Oukacha, I could understand. But Kim Dotcom, what would we debate?If someone was with us, and was willing to chat about Islam, then I wouldn't mind debating him, Majid Oukacha, Kim Dotcom, or even Al-Baghdadi!
Quote from: aa1234779 on December 23, 2018, 08:15 PMe.g. China houses more than 1.3 million Muslims in concentration camps, separates families, takes away children from their mothers, punishes anyone who has a Quran gravely, and tries to brainwash Muslims to be atheist and a good law-abiding government worshiping subject.
Quote from: humbert on December 25, 2018, 03:42 AMWhat you just stated is an example of what is officially an atheist state. They are ruled by governments whose intent is to crush religion and impose atheism as its official policy. In no way can this be compared with a secular government. In [for example] Canada, there are churches, mosques, synagogues, Bhuddist temples, etc. They all live side by side in peace. The government does not bother them nor do they impose their ways on the rest of us. This is what I mean by a secular government and, most importantly, total and complete separation of church and state. This is the only way to guarantee freedom OF religion, and, equally as important, freedom FROM religion.Incidentally, I just did a Google search. If you're ever in San Antonio and want to meet me, there are 3 mosques here. You can visit any of them freely. I give you solid guarantees that nobody will bother you.
Quote from: aa1234779 on December 25, 2018, 11:13 AMIn turn, we all know that communist states such as China, North Korea, and the now abolished USSR impose atheism upon the people by inhumane means. So, either communism is also secular (maybe even the purist form), or atheism is just another man-made religion forced on unwilling citizens. Wouldn't that make atheism a religion? Which is it in your opinion?
Quote from: aa1234779 on December 25, 2018, 11:13 AMIf none of the above, are the communist states mentioned not secular, leaving only liberal democracies as secular?
Quote from: aa1234779 on December 25, 2018, 11:13 AMBTW, I don't mind visiting San Diego one day. I've never been to the west coast, nothing west past Mississippi/Missouri. I love the states not for the aggression on humanity its government commits, nor for the double-standards when it comes to human life (At home, and abroad), nor for the racist culture that's spreading like a wildfire in a dry forest.But for the honorable & kind people I knew there that truly believed in "Freedom & Justice for all". And I wouldn't lie if I told you that
Quote from: humbert on December 26, 2018, 04:50 AMAtheism is a belief (or belief system). It's not a religion because there is no god to worship nor is there any set a values a typical relgion would have. Like all belief systems, it can be forcibly imposed and even become a country's official policy. This is precisely what happened in countries like Communist China and Stalinist Russia. Forcible imposition of any belief system is not just wrong, it's an abomination against humanity. In that regard Communist China, Stalinist Russia, Saudi Arabia, Iran and even Vatican City (a sovereign nation too) are all the same garbage. I firmly believe this despite the fact that I'm an atheist myself. We're not all bad as many religions would lead you to believe.
QuoteLet's assume in this example the French government is truly secular (sadly not the case). Let's go to a nice Mediterranean beach on a summer day. We have a woman dressed in a burkini and, 3 meters away, another one who is totally naked (legal in Europe as you know):Atheist state: Woman in Burkink is arrested, accused of practicing religion illegallyReligious state: Naked woman arrested, accused of indecencySecular state: No one arrested, the rights of both women equally respected under the lawThat sums it up.
QuoteOf course I know this country has established itself as a self-appointed world policeman. Just like everywhere, there is injustice, racism, double-standards etc. Having visited this USA, I'm sure you agree that in real life these problems are nowhere near as bad as the news media would lead you to believe. Here in my neighborhood there are people who hang American flags outside their homes. They probably believe in that "Freedom & Justice for all" garbage. Despite this, nobody has yet knocked on my door to ask why I don't have a flag outside my house. We live in peace, we respect each other and I have no issue with someone hanging a flag just like I have no issue with you being a Muslim. As Mexico's Benito Juarez once said, "Respect for the right of others is peace". A great quote by a great man.
QuoteOh, and before I forget. Here in San Antonio I personally have seen women wearing hijabs and even a few wearing niqabs. Some of them were doing their jobs, such as one serving coffee at Starbucks. Another once is a nice girl who waits at the bus stop to go to school in the morning. She is together with her other friends who do NOT wear hijabs and they seem to get along well. The women are free to dress as they please, NOBODY bothers them - in fact if somebody mistreats them they will be arrested by the police. Sadly in France this does not appear to be the case.